BMW S1000R

Main S1000R Boards => S1000R - General Chat => Topic started by: S1KR187 on November 20, 2019, 03:31:16 PM

Title: Camchain noise
Post by: S1KR187 on November 20, 2019, 03:31:16 PM
Hey guys. I have a 2018 S1KR. I recently bougjt a new tensioner because the camchain is VERY noisy, in every gear and any speed. I bought a new tensioner today and stil need to install it. I had both tensioners in my hand, old and new, and I compressed them by hand. Both had that scratchy like feel to them. Now my question, if I install the new tensioner and this camchain noise/rattling is still there, what could be wrong? Bike has 9000km on and I recently had a Rapid bike EVO, sprint filter, ECU flahed and full Akra installed. Bime was running no prob for about 1000km,now this started. Should I be heavily concerned? I see these mods as bolt on and it doesnt reaaly mess arou d with the reliability. Correct me if Im wrong please and any thoughts. Thanks guys. Ride safe :152:
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: podders on November 20, 2019, 07:09:51 PM
If when you replace it and its still noisy, its possibly camshaft wear.

My local BMW tech tells me they have had a few '18 bikes in with premature wear to the lobes, apparently very noisy when they do go.

Warranty job anyway.
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: cheese on November 21, 2019, 12:09:54 AM
This is a common issue on these bikes. I had mine changed to the silver plug version and noise is gone. 20K miles. BMW paid for it. Also my bike has full Akra, and power commander... no issues
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: VARRAKK on November 21, 2019, 07:58:25 AM
*Originally Posted by S1KR187 [+]
Hey guys. I have a 2018 S1KR. I recently bougjt a new tensioner because the camchain is VERY noisy, in every gear and any speed. I bought a new tensioner today and stil need to install it. I had both tensioners in my hand, old and new, and I compressed them by hand. Both had that scratchy like feel to them. Now my question, if I install the new tensioner and this camchain noise/rattling is still there, what could be wrong? Bike has 9000km on and I recently had a Rapid bike EVO, sprint filter, ECU flahed and full Akra installed. Bime was running no prob for about 1000km,now this started. Should I be heavily concerned? I see these mods as bolt on and it doesnt reaaly mess arou d with the reliability. Correct me if Im wrong please and any thoughts. Thanks guys. Ride safe :152:

On my '18 the Cam Shaft was busted already at 6500km.
Record the sound of yours.
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: S1KR187 on November 21, 2019, 06:10:49 PM
Have aproblem posting the vid. I replaced the tensioner and the bike idled for bout 5min and that chain rattling sound is still there. Would a manual tensioner make any difference and can I ride the way it is?
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: Mitslol on November 22, 2019, 12:17:33 AM
Did you buy the silver plug for the hydraulic tensioner or did you buy a mechanical cam chain tensioner?

Or did you buy a whole new hydraulic tensioner?

A new hydraulic tensioner without the updated silver plug won't do much.
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: S1KR187 on November 24, 2019, 03:20:45 PM
Hey all. I spoke to the workshop manager at my local BMW and he said I must bring in the bike so they can start to check. He wholeheartedly told me that any work or replacement of parts wont be covered under warranty due to the mods Ive done :435:  I rrally want my bike to be fixed, but Im abit in 2 minds:mind no1 is telling me to take the bike to get fixed while mind no2 is telling me to try a mechanical tensioner and c what happens :087:
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: windyrun on November 24, 2019, 04:39:23 PM
I'm sorry to hear about your issues especially since i have an '18 as well.

That said, it seems people are trying to help, but need answers to their questions.

 ... sounds like installing the silver plug is most likely the next step. If that doesn't help then you should take it to the shop and get their assessment assuming they are not charging you anything since all they can come up with other than the silver plug is a cam shaft problem. That would not be good since they will not cover it under warranty.

You may also consider going to a different dealer (if you have one). There is no point in arguing with a dealer over what they will do regarding warranty (in my experience) although I did get a very satisfactory response from Triumph NA (said they would pay warranty and any towing charges) when dealer said open my wallet and given them my money and maybe they would fix a factory recall in a few months when convenient for them


I'd stick a $50 silver plug on it and see what happens.
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: S1KR187 on November 24, 2019, 05:18:33 PM
Hi Windyrun. Thanks so much for your comment. Im also leaning more towards seeing what I can do first before I take it to the dealer. This way, if I fit the silver plug and the problem remains, I can just re-fit the black OEM plug. No my next question, where can I buy the silver plug? Is it an item from BMW or an aftermarket? If someo e has a link, I would appreciate it.  :152:
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: windyrun on November 24, 2019, 05:20:59 PM
Roblaw and Simonuk have posted on the silver plug in the cam chain noise bulletin thread herein (from bmw I believe) so look there.
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: S1KR187 on November 24, 2019, 05:25:21 PM
Thanks Windyrun :062:
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: SimonUK on November 24, 2019, 06:21:48 PM
BMW part - Here is the part number (only to be installed after 15,000K if found to be needed):
  11 31 8 534 849 SCREW PLUG, SILVER - M24X1,5
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: Hooligan on November 24, 2019, 06:31:23 PM
A couple of things you could do on your own... I tend to troubleshoot the easy things first.
 Check for proper oil level in the site glass as per manual, being the oem tensioner is hydraulically activated improper levels could have a negative impact. Dump the oil in the bike and inspect both the magnetic drain plug and the oil itself for signs of excessive metal shavings. Could indicate a more serious problem.
Just a thought.
Hope you get things sorted   
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: windyrun on November 25, 2019, 03:46:03 AM
 :460:
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: S1KR187 on November 25, 2019, 07:40:25 AM
Hi Hooligan, will do so :002:
Thanks SimonUk, I managed to order the part from BMW. Once Ive installed, I will give feedback. Thanks again :047:
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: S1KR187 on November 27, 2019, 03:46:19 PM
Hi all. Update: Ive installed the silver plug, but the damn rattle noise is still there :013: :013: I guess now the only option left is to take to BMW to get stripped. Im guessing then its either a really stretch camchain, faulty camshaft or sprocket? Gonna grit my teeth cos of the whole "cant warranty repair cos u did mods to the bike" Bloody hell. I bet the labour alone is gonna be damn ridiculous :003:
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: SimonUK on November 27, 2019, 04:46:18 PM
Just want to re-iterate that these bikes are noisy! check if your dealer has a demo or used bike, and get them to fire her up and take a listen, just to make sure you have an issue before getting raped for the strip down.
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: S1KR187 on November 27, 2019, 05:02:22 PM
Hi Simon. Youre right, Ive read a bunch of comments from different owners that the S1K's are noisy. What chaps my ass the most is that tje bike is barely 1 yr old with only 9000kms on. I dont push the bike in max rev range and it hasnt been on the track. I hate to to compare but my Fireblade which I had for 8 yrs, did numerous trackdays ridden hard in B class and she never gave me a bit of crap. Ok, back to point, Simon this noise was not there at all and then just one morning, SURPRISE. I hear the rattle over my full Akra system, which I believe you know, is very loud. Apologies for all my blabbering like an old tired wife :006: Guess Im trying to find reason vs the money I have to fork out.
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: windyrun on November 27, 2019, 05:43:33 PM
Did you check the oil level? Someone mentioned if low cam chain will be loud.
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: SimonUK on November 27, 2019, 06:40:29 PM
The reason I am suggesting things before being reemed, I have a 14 R(30k miles) and a 16 XR(11k miles), both with full Akrapovic exhausts. MY R engine is noisier and rattlier than the XR, but it always has been. It was progressively getting noisier on start-up, but the updated tensioner fixed that somewhat. I

I purchased the cam chain kit and have that ready to install when I decide to get the valves checked again.
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: S1KR187 on November 27, 2019, 06:55:51 PM
@Windyrun, when my bike is held upright, the sightglass shows full. I take it hen the level must be correct. The day the rattle started, was the day it went for the 2nd service and oil n filter was replaced. It was then that the BMW tech called me n asked if Im aware that there is a rattle sound that does not go away. I told him yes, I noticed it that morning, but I figured it was due to me starting n immediately riding and was caused by coldstart. What puzzles me more is why did the tech not identify that noise since it doesnt go away even after 5 min of idling?

@SimonUK, I want to get a second opinion and compare the sound to another SKR from a different Mottorrad. From your knowledge, do you know or remember if an engine from any S1000 range ever bombed out die to this excessive rattle?
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: SimonUK on November 27, 2019, 07:03:46 PM
There have been cam shaft failures. But it is hard to say if it because they were noisy, or how noisy they actually were.

Can you remove the exhaust and fueling modules and take it to another  dealer??
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: Enzio on November 28, 2019, 05:52:08 AM
The CPA is in your favour - they can only cancel your warranty if they can prove that the modifications caused the failure.

As per Simon's request, take it to another dealer.
If it was older, I would have suggested you inspect the cam yourself, but in this case they need to take some responsibility to sort it out.

For interest - who is your current dealer?
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: S1KR187 on November 28, 2019, 06:27:28 AM
Hi Enzio. Good point :084: :084:
The dealer is Motorrad Rustenburg. How abouts do I go to argue my point though with BMW?
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: Enzio on November 28, 2019, 06:30:28 AM
First, bring it through to Zambesi without any tuning modules.

If they give you the same feedback, log a customer care case with BMW directly.
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: S1KR187 on November 28, 2019, 07:24:00 AM
Hi Enzio. I spoke to Centurion Bavarian, and he took my VIN no after I explained the whole story. He phoned me back 5min later and said aPUMA was released by BMW stating that any S1KR that has engine noise, have to be replaced under warranty. And he said it will be done regardless of the mods on my bike :152: :152: Thank God
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: Enzio on November 28, 2019, 08:01:01 AM
That's great news!
Glad you got good service from them, I hope you have a better experience than I have had.

Are they going to replace the whole engine?
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: S1KR187 on November 28, 2019, 08:18:38 AM
Sounds like the issue is around the camshaft, camchain guides etc. So I take it those components. Gonna tow the bike there tomorrow morning :002:
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: Hooligan on November 28, 2019, 12:17:41 PM
Anyone know if/where you can find these bulletins? I figured there would be a site where you could plug in your VIN....If so, a link would be appreciated. 
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: windyrun on November 28, 2019, 01:12:26 PM
*Originally Posted by S1KR187 [+]
Hi Enzio. I spoke to Centurion Bavarian, and he took my VIN no after I explained the whole story. He phoned me back 5min later and said aPUMA was released by BMW stating that any S1KR that has engine noise, have to be replaced under warranty. And he said it will be done regardless of the mods on my bike :152: :152: Thank God

That is fantastic news! I am so happy for you  :305: :821: :046: :062:
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: S1KR187 on November 28, 2019, 02:28:48 PM
@Windyrun,thanks alot :152:
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: SimonUK on November 28, 2019, 03:21:54 PM
Please keep us updated as to what they find and what gets replaced.
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: S1KR187 on November 28, 2019, 03:41:19 PM
@SimonUK,will do so indeed :002:
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: S1KR187 on November 29, 2019, 03:48:24 PM
Hey all. Dropped my bike off today. Had a chat to the service manager, and he told me my bike is the 2nd one in a couple of months with this problem. Got sumthing to do with the camshafts lobes. Apparently the hardfacing or what have u, start to come off and this has an effect on the valves and camchain. He will probably have authorization by Wednesday to go head and replace, if theres stock of the parts needed. Otherwise its 2 weeks back order from zee Germans.
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: windyrun on November 29, 2019, 05:14:40 PM
Thanks for the update
It would be interesting to know if there is a mileage after which one needn't worry about the hard face failing.
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: podders on November 29, 2019, 08:25:51 PM
*Originally Posted by windyrun [+]
Thanks for the update
It would be interesting to know if there is a mileage after which one needn't worry about the hard face failing.

No, my friendly tech reports they have had some issues with 2019 bikes with next to no mileage on them.

So he tells me, BMWs process is to drop the engine oil and if there is signs of metal in the oil, its a replacement engine...otherwise just the camshafts/chain etc.

sorry it wasnt brilliant news anyway mate.
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: S1KR187 on December 04, 2019, 08:50:36 AM
Hey all. Just had a call from the BMW Service department where my bike is at. All parts has been authorized for replacement, $9700 worth, excl labour. Everything thats got to do with the cam. Camshaft, chain, guides, tensioner etc will be replaced and completely paid for by BMW :152: What a relief :156:
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: S1KR187 on December 04, 2019, 08:53:19 AM
Sorry, $3200 excl labour :001:
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: windyrun on December 04, 2019, 11:39:23 AM
 :821: :063:
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: S1KR187 on December 09, 2019, 05:48:27 PM
Hey all. Had a call past Saturday from the service department. My bike is finished and according to the Tech, she purrs like a kitten and very quiet. He say u can actually here the Akra full sytem again :062:
Have to make plan now to go pick her as sbe is bout 1h30min drive away. Apparently upon stripping, it was indeed the camshafts hardening surface that came off. Glad its fixed. Total of 8 day. From taking her in, getting authorization, parts to the dealer and getting parts replaced :062:
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: SimonUK on December 09, 2019, 10:48:02 PM
Excellent outcome. Let us know what you think when you get her back.
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: Mitslol on December 10, 2019, 04:38:38 PM
Seems like the 2017+ bikes have more problems with the camshaft failing. Found some similair cases on YouTube all facelift bikes. Glad that its fixed within warranty though.  :063:
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: Enzio on December 11, 2019, 06:57:52 AM
Glad you got it sorted
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: Mark_62 on December 11, 2019, 02:18:31 PM
Mitslol,

What are face lift bikes??

Thanks
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: SimonUK on December 11, 2019, 02:26:18 PM
*Originally Posted by Mark_62 [+]
Mitslol,

What are face lift bikes??

I am going to assume he is referring to the 17+ bikes that got revised(new frame, slightly more power, QS_Pro, slightly different side panels).
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: Mitslol on December 11, 2019, 03:20:11 PM
*Originally Posted by SimonUK [+]
I am going to assume he is referring to the 17+ bikes that got revised(new frame, slightly more power, QS_Pro, slightly different side panels).
*Originally Posted by Mark_62 [+]
Mitslol,

What are face lift bikes??

Thanks

Yes i meant the 17+ bikes
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: S1KR187 on December 13, 2019, 02:20:07 PM
Hey all. Picked up my bike today. All in order. The red devil sounds like a S1K again and not a 19-sumthing tractor. Rode for bout 200km back home. No issues, did a couple of twisties. Glad shes back tonormal. Inlet and outlet camshafts, rockers, cam chain, sprockets, tensioner was replaced and valve clearences checked. All in order.
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: windyrun on December 13, 2019, 02:21:35 PM
 :047:
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: S1KR187 on December 13, 2019, 02:50:23 PM
 :152: :152: :158: @Windyrun
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: SimonUK on December 13, 2019, 05:16:15 PM
Excellent outcome!! I t is often hard to answer this particular question when members ask if there engine is noisy because the S1000 engine is inherently noisy out of the box.  When I compare my S1000R to K1300S (both in-line 4s from the same manufacturer), the K purrs like the proverbial kitten with the S100 sounding like a bag of spanners. But I now have 30k miles on the SkR and it still sounds the same.

Just a point, I actually had to replace the inlet camshaft on the K, the tech noticed a little mark on it when they did the valve check (I guess at 36k), there was no un-toward noise though that caused any alarm bells. I ending up ordering the camshaft from Germany and save $300 on it(that included shipping, etc)
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: S1KR187 on December 13, 2019, 05:45:35 PM
Exactly @SimonUK. I can clearly distinguish the "normal cam sound" from a "faulty cam sound" For me itwas a case of actually hearing both and realizing that sumthing is actually wrong based on the different sounds. Im just glad its sorted and hope the problem doesnt stick its nasty neck out again. Gonna take her out on Sunday for a nice stretch. The Tech said cos of the work that was done, valve clearence doesnt ha e to be done again on the next 20k service.  :152:
Title: Re: Camchain noise
Post by: Enzio on December 17, 2019, 06:03:20 AM
Great result - and I have to agree I find this engine to be fair bit "noisier" than that of my old K7 GSX-R1000 that had 80k km on the clock  :008:

The thing I don't like about the myriad of mechanical noises, is that subconsciously it feels like it won't last as long as something that makes less mechanical noise.
Time will tell, I guess